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Post by Lommaren on Sept 23, 2017 5:18:14 GMT -5
Granted a bit differing normal periods but if we convert the Swedish locations in this range to 1981-2010 either sourced by Météo Climat or estimated they'll be like: Stockholm 23/14 (Jul), 0/-3 (Jan) Gothenburg 21/13 (Jul), 2/-3 (Jan) (the wettest at 873.8 mm, although wetter microclimates about 1,000 mm exist). Malmö 22/14 (Jul), 3/-1 (Jan) Lund 23/13 (Jul), 2/-2 (Jan) Växjö 22/12 (Jul), 1/-4 (Jan) Norrköping 22/13 (Jul), 0/-4 (Jan) (rain shadow around 500 mm) Linköping 22/12 (Jul), 0/-5 (Jan) Örebro 22/12 (Jul), 0/-6 (Jan) Uppsala 23/12 (Jul), 0/-6 (Jan) Gotland 20/12 (Jul), 1/-3 (Jan) The UK then? Manchester 20/12 (Jul), 7/2 (Jan) Liverpool 19/13 (Jul), 7/2 (Jan) Hull 22/13 (July), 7/2 (Jan) Doncaster 22/12 (Jul), 7/1 (Jan) Hawarden 21/12 (Jul), 7/2 (Jan) Middlesbrough 20/11 (Jul), 6/1 (Jan) (rain shadow, in the 500's again, so the driest of the bunch along with Doncaster). Edinburgh 19/11 (Jul), 7/1 (Jan) Glasgow 20/12 (Jul), 7/2 (Jan); 1249 mm rain! Braemar 18/9 (Jul), 4/-1 (Jan) Aberdeen 18/11 (Jul), 6/1 (Jan) These ten samples each should give a clear picture on which to decide your ballot  For me, 21 high-22C somewhere is the breaking point in being worth skipping the cold winter we have here. So for me, only Doncaster is actually an upgrade on Southern Sweden, with Razza's station at Hawarden being arguably a nose ahead of where I live. Doesn't mean it beats Lund though 1, Hull 2, Lund 3, Doncaster 4, Stockholm 5, Hawarden 6, Malmö 7, Norrköping 8, Uppsala 9, Växjö 10, Manchester So, a majority Sweden in my top ten, even though my favourite climate of the bunch is in England. Therefore, I'll have to go for "greatest approximation". Only the far south and sheltered parts of the northern UK have liveable climates, whereas Scotland is an utter junkyard. Instead, the entirety of southern Sweden offer similar conditions and recognizable patterns. You would notice a massive difference between Hull and Aberdeen in July, but not sure about noticing any differences between Lund and Uppsala whatsoever. Therefore, if I did a top 50, southern Sweden would run all over northern UK and therefore it just edges my vote here. I had Lund above Doncaster because it's warmed more in the last 15 years than Doncaster has. I deliberately left out the far north of the UK because it's so abysmal. Thurso's and Elgin's 16C highs in July and 25C record heat  ... that's like asking for a Swedish landslide! So, who wins?  |
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Post by Babu on Sept 23, 2017 6:53:22 GMT -5
Sweden is quite a bit sunnier and has got quite superior summers. Any semi-coastal location from Malmö to Nyköping is superior to anything above 53° in England.
Also Lommaren, why do you keep insisting that south-western Svealand lies in a rainshadow? There is no terrain above 200m anywhere south of Norrland except around Jönköping, quite far south from Svealand. And 350m hills aren't enough to create rain shadows...
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Post by Lommaren on Sept 23, 2017 7:10:28 GMT -5
South-eastern you mean? It's because northwesterlies are blocked from coming in due to the Norwegian mountains, and then most rainfall is absorbed at around 100 m asl in Halland and Western Götaland (Torup and Borås). That renders the clouds often rather harmless once they reach here. So in effect, it becomes a warmed-up subarctic rainfall pattern here that looks like a rain shadow when comparing Nyköping to Gothenburg, similar as it looks when comparing Middlesbrough to Blackpool Get me? |
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Post by Babu on Sept 23, 2017 7:24:12 GMT -5
South-eastern you mean? It's because northwesterlies are blocked from coming in due to the Norwegian mountains, and then most rainfall is absorbed at around 100 m asl in Halland and Western Götaland (Torup and Borås). That renders the clouds often rather harmless once they reach here. So in effect, it becomes a warmed-up subarctic rainfall pattern here that looks like a rain shadow when comparing Nyköping to Gothenburg, similar as it looks when comparing Middlesbrough to Blackpool Get me? The whole of Sweden (except perhaps Götaland) and even Finland lies in a rain shadow of the Scandes, that's nothing new. Nyköping is not in more of a rain shadow thsn any other part of Sweden north of Göteborg. Nyköping might be drier than Örebro or Falun, but that doesn't make it a rain shadow. Sahara isn't a rain shadow just because it's drier than its surroundings. |
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Post by Lommaren on Sept 23, 2017 7:36:44 GMT -5
Hm well... yeah... you do have a point in that Kristiansand is a bit south of even Linköping by some decimals of latitude. The Scandes have a bit of an impact, but how would you explain the 484 mm of Kalmar then? It's at 56.32 N after all. Surely the Halland (Torup) and Småland highlands must have a bit of an impact there similar to the Pennines? |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2017 7:37:20 GMT -5
@ baba
there most certainly is higher terrain south of norrland. storvätteshågna is 1200 masl, and in NW svealand. N västmanland and C värmaland both have terrain +400masl. i agree "rain shadow" is a bit of an exaggeration. but the east coast in götaland is clearly drier than the west coast for geographical reasons. the rainiest place in halland has x2 as much precipitation as e.g kalmar.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2017 10:17:07 GMT -5
The UK is mostly toilet bowl climates north of East Anglia. Chester and York, both the nearest stations to me and Dean, are the best of the bunch, but the overall theme is similar to what my parents experience when thinking about me, disappointment.
I guess northern UK's appeal would be towards those who really hate freezing temperatures, and those who like to grow fancier plants.
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Post by Lommaren on Sept 23, 2017 12:11:47 GMT -5
Yes, East Anglia has a much better climate than here in my opinion. The problem north of that is not only the temps, but also the absurd lack of sunshine. For me, had it been England vs South Sweden as in the whole of England, it would've been an easy win for England thanks to its southern part. Sweden is not as dependent on the deep south thanks to the winter moderation the Baltic Sea provides and also the summer shelter the Scandinavian Mountains provide.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2017 12:20:31 GMT -5
Yeah, Sweden wins most of these battles due to the sunshine advantage. Some places in the northern half of Britain are getting down to 1200 sunshine hours, even lower in some cases.
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Post by Lommaren on Sept 23, 2017 12:25:32 GMT -5
I can take it if it doesn't rain more than here behind the Pennines (Barnsley, Doncaster, Middlesbrough) but when that increases as well, it makes it rather bleak. To spend a summer in Blackpool, Liverpool or Carlisle would feel like a punishment more than anything.
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Post by boombo on Sept 23, 2017 12:26:46 GMT -5
I've gone for Sweden because summers are sunnier, winters are more properly wintry and presumably the day-to-day weather isn't as changeable being further from the Atlantic, but in our defence there's more to it than just the January/July temps with you being further north, if you add April/October temperatures to the mix the balance tilts a bit more in our favour.
For example Stockholm averages a high of 9.9C in October, while even Bingley higher up still gets 12.1C.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2017 12:29:24 GMT -5
The most frustrating part about Swedish climates is their wintry shoulder seasons.
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Post by Lommaren on Sept 23, 2017 12:33:24 GMT -5
Well... yeah... but everything's relative. October here is only 2C cooler than Aberdeen and April is rather similar to there. The positive about spring is that we can get 25C days as early as April 25 pretty much with some luck, due to the high sun angle and more land for the air to travel, so although frustrating, I'd say spring gives more highlights here than it does in Northern England. I can't for the world of me see say Hull get consecutive 28C days in May like we had this year.
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Post by boombo on Sept 23, 2017 12:41:12 GMT -5
I don't know about Hull, but sometimes the west of the country can do best at that time of year: winds often come from the east, the Pennines create a foehn effect so the west coast is warm and sunny when the east coast is cold and misty because of the North Sea. Blackpool had a 27, 28 and 25 consecutively this past May for example, actually their best three-day spell all year. www.tutiempo.net/clima/05-2017/ws-33180.html |
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Post by Lommaren on Sept 23, 2017 12:42:13 GMT -5
That's stunning, half the place must've suffered from heat stroke |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2017 12:48:04 GMT -5
But Aberdeen is the coldest city in the UK. Quite a selective comparison.
Perhaps Hull wouldn't record consecutive 28C days in May, but Northern Scotland can. It recorded temperatures above 30C this May.
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Post by boombo on Sept 23, 2017 12:48:11 GMT -5
The unfortunate thing about the west coast is that it can easily get front-loaded summers like that with the best weather really early on, two years in a row now I've gone to the beach at Morecambe really early in the season with 25C+ and cloudless skies thinking how great it is that I might have days like this on and off for the next 3-4 months, then the westerlies come back and July/August are full of 18C/showery crap  |
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Post by flamingGalah on Sept 23, 2017 13:53:48 GMT -5
UK. Only for the milder winters, which are more important to me...
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2017 11:52:17 GMT -5
Depends what the standards are like for indoor heating in Sweden. I heard they're pretty good. In that case I'd take Malmo over anywhere in Uk Midlands and north.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2017 12:02:19 GMT -5
Depends what the standards are like for indoor heating in Sweden. I heard they're pretty good. In that case I'd take Malmo over anywhere in Uk Midlands and north. I dare say Swedish houses have very good heating and insulation. |
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For me, 21 high-22C somewhere is the breaking point in being worth skipping the cold winter we have here. So for me, only Doncaster is actually an upgrade on Southern Sweden, with Razza's station at Hawarden being arguably a nose ahead of where I live. Doesn't mean it beats Lund though 
... that's like asking for a Swedish landslide!
