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Post by Babu on Dec 1, 2017 3:23:20 GMT -5
Yeah why is it?, 2003 always seemd a bit low to me. I have seen other data with more recemt averages of about 2130, so I'm guessing an electronically measured station closer to the city/Hauraki Gulf would certainly read even higher. Two electronic stations are already recording in the range I suggested. On a map the NIWA had posted regarding sunshine in Auckland, 2000h was actually just the sunniest tiny area. 90% of the city was in the 1800-1900h range. |
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Post by longaotian on Dec 1, 2017 4:21:07 GMT -5
Two electronic stations are already recording in the range I suggested. On a map the NIWA had posted regarding sunshine in Auckland, 2000h was actually just the sunniest tiny area. 90% of the city was in the 1800-1900h range. Those maps are incorrect....it really wasn't hard to tell especially if you referenced other locations around the country  |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2017 4:30:37 GMT -5
Masterton is only 50 miles away. A bit of a stretch,I will admit, but within Wellington authority limits. Clareville is even closer. Weatherbase shows 23C+ highs (the threshold I was using for Wellington proper), for several sites in the Hutt Valley. It's not about the best features of distinct station, but about having a good overview of an area. Auckland has a better summer than anywhere in the southern UK, and is about as sunny as the sunniest, without the dramatic drop off, as soon as summer ends. To class somewhere 50 miles away as a "suburb" is indeed a stretch, and as I've said, Auckland has lower sunshine hours during the warmer months than a bunch of coastal places in southern England. That's poor in my view, since even the sunniest UK climates have cloudy summers. Auckland on average has better summer days than anywhere in the UK, but also has less heat potential. Even London usually offers a few decent >30C days every year. I didn't say that Masterton was a suburb, only a within the urban authority. Weatherbase does list locations higher than 23C for within Wellington. Auckland has 49.6% of sunshine, during the three summer months, while Shanklin (the sunniest) has 51.6%. Not really significant considering Auckland has sunnier areas. The convective nature of Auckland summer makes up for it anyway, in my opinion. Shanklin is sunnier than it's rivals in the UK, as well, while Auckland has sunnier regions in either direction. London gets more 30C+ days than my climate as well, but I don't get the impression that people who like warmth, would swap a London summer, for my summer. |
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Post by longaotian on Dec 1, 2017 4:34:13 GMT -5
Also, Auckland's summer lasts far longer than anywhere in UK, take London the warmest location in the country, Auckland averages both 5C and 8C higher than London in April/October and May/November respectively without falling back into an overly cloudy winter. Also, Aucklands sunniest month in summer is easily higher than Londons even without factoring in the latitude/day length differences, it's obvious that some form of decent sun AND warmth in the summer is just something that can't be found together anywhere in the UK, something which Auckland still manages.
Note-Even those highs are some of the coolest in the metro area, majority of the city has around 25C+ average highs in the warmest month
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Post by Babu on Dec 1, 2017 6:47:13 GMT -5
One station in Auckland has a mean maximum above 30'C for three months, and another for two.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2017 12:50:02 GMT -5
To class somewhere 50 miles away as a "suburb" is indeed a stretch, and as I've said, Auckland has lower sunshine hours during the warmer months than a bunch of coastal places in southern England. That's poor in my view, since even the sunniest UK climates have cloudy summers. Auckland on average has better summer days than anywhere in the UK, but also has less heat potential. Even London usually offers a few decent >30C days every year. I didn't say that Masterton was a suburb, only a within the urban authority. Weatherbase does list locations higher than 23C for within Wellington. Auckland has 49.6% of sunshine, during the three summer months, while Shanklin (the sunniest) has 51.6%. Not really significant considering Auckland has sunnier areas. The convective nature of Auckland summer makes up for it anyway, in my opinion. Shanklin is sunnier than it's rivals in the UK, as well, while Auckland has sunnier regions in either direction. London gets more 30C+ days than my climate as well, but I don't get the impression that people who like warmth, would swap a London summer, for my summer. You claimed a suburb of the city was producing average highs of over 24C, I asked for proof and you linked the stats for Masterson, saying it was basically a part of Wellington. Despite clearly being a small village/town about an hour's drive away from the actual city. Shanklin is roughly the same as places such as Portsmouth and Bognor Regis, all are slightly sunnier than Auckland in summer. Probably not noticeable, but the point is that I consider them to have cloudy summers. So to boast about Auckland's sunshine when it can't even produce sunny summers seems a bit odd. I'm not really sure what the selling point is for Auckland, besides being comfortable. It offers no real heat, or cold. It's comfortable, but that isn't what most people on a weather forum are interested in. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2017 12:53:13 GMT -5
One station in Auckland has a mean maximum above 30'C for three months, and another for two. Well, if somebody made a climate box for that station I'd probably give it a much better rating than the current one on Wikipedia. |
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Post by Babu on Dec 1, 2017 13:11:31 GMT -5
One station in Auckland has a mean maximum above 30'C for three months, and another for two. Well, if somebody made a climate box for that station I'd probably give it a much better rating than the current one on Wikipedia. Fuck wait, I looked at record highs... Though the mean max was still 28-29 for four months which is enough for an annual 30 at least. |
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Post by rwood2 on Dec 1, 2017 17:30:48 GMT -5
Two electronic stations are already recording in the range I suggested. On a map the NIWA had posted regarding sunshine in Auckland, 2000h was actually just the sunniest tiny area. 90% of the city was in the 1800-1900h range. Any map implying that is garbage. I have sun data for all NZ sites going right back to the early 1900s. Central Auckland historically averaged - on manual equipment - over several sites - about 2120 hours. The MOTAT city location using electronic means is averaging at least 2250, ditto for Albany in the northwest. |
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Post by rwood2 on Dec 1, 2017 17:33:44 GMT -5
To class somewhere 50 miles away as a "suburb" is indeed a stretch, and as I've said, Auckland has lower sunshine hours during the warmer months than a bunch of coastal places in southern England. That's poor in my view, since even the sunniest UK climates have cloudy summers. Auckland on average has better summer days than anywhere in the UK, but also has less heat potential. Even London usually offers a few decent >30C days every year. I didn't say that Masterton was a suburb, only a within the urban authority. Weatherbase does list locations higher than 23C for within Wellington. Auckland has 49.6% of sunshine, during the three summer months, while Shanklin (the sunniest) has 51.6%. Not really significant considering Auckland has sunnier areas. The convective nature of Auckland summer makes up for it anyway, in my opinion. Shanklin is sunnier than it's rivals in the UK, as well, while Auckland has sunnier regions in either direction. London gets more 30C+ days than my climate as well, but I don't get the impression that people who like warmth, would swap a London summer, for my summer. That 49.6% must be for Mangere, cloudier than most of Auckland. Mechanics Bay and Auckland City older records give 55% for Jan-Feb for MB and 53-54% for Auck City. |
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Post by rwood2 on Dec 1, 2017 17:37:50 GMT -5
Well, if somebody made a climate box for that station I'd probably give it a much better rating than the current one on Wikipedia. Fuck wait, I looked at record highs... Though the mean max was still 28-29 for four months which is enough for an annual 30 at least. No NZ site with records accepted by the climate database has a mean Tmax above 25.9C in any summer month (Te Teko in Bay of Plenty averages that in January and February). Henderson in Auckland averages 25.6C in February. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2017 18:57:01 GMT -5
I didn't say that Masterton was a suburb, only a within the urban authority. Weatherbase does list locations higher than 23C for within Wellington. Auckland has 49.6% of sunshine, during the three summer months, while Shanklin (the sunniest) has 51.6%. Not really significant considering Auckland has sunnier areas. The convective nature of Auckland summer makes up for it anyway, in my opinion. Shanklin is sunnier than it's rivals in the UK, as well, while Auckland has sunnier regions in either direction. London gets more 30C+ days than my climate as well, but I don't get the impression that people who like warmth, would swap a London summer, for my summer. You claimed a suburb of the city was producing average highs of over 24C, I asked for proof and you linked the stats for Masterson, saying it was basically a part of Wellington. Despite clearly being a small village/town about an hour's drive away from the actual city. Shanklin is roughly the same as places such as Portsmouth and Bognor Regis, all are slightly sunnier than Auckland in summer. Probably not noticeable, but the point is that I consider them to have cloudy summers. So to boast about Auckland's sunshine when it can't even produce sunny summers seems a bit odd. I'm not really sure what the selling point is for Auckland, besides being comfortable. It offers no real heat, or cold. It's comfortable, but that isn't what most people on a weather forum are interested in. I was responding to comments about Wellington being similar to northern English summers, by pointing out it was as warm as Portsmouth, with warmer areas still Even at 50 miles out from Wellington, Masterton is still warmer than anywhere in the UK. Fair enough about Auckland only being as sunny as the UK's sunniest, but I suspect that Auckland at least gets a much more interesting cloudscape than the English coast. I'm not really trying to sell Auckland's climate, only that I think the summers are better than the best UK summers. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2017 19:13:06 GMT -5
How do you rate how interesting the cloudscape is? Stayed on the south coast of the UK a lot in summer and it has a lot less overcast than inland and a lot of cumulo-nimbus cloud activity. There are more thunderstorms than Auckland with 15 days of thunder a year on average. Quite a lot of storms travel up from the continent in the summer which makes for spectacular cloudscapes even when they don't always hit the UK head on. As for winter though, there will be more stratus type clouds in the UK's south coast than Aucklands winters.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2017 19:25:31 GMT -5
How do you rate how interesting the cloudscape is? Stayed on the south coast of the UK a lot in summer and it has a lot less overcast than inland and a lot of cumulo-nimbus cloud activity. There are more thunderstorms than Auckland with 15 days of thunder a year on average. Quite a lot of storms travel up from the continent in the summer which makes for spectacular cloudscapes even when they don't always hit the UK head on. As for winter though, there will be more stratus type clouds in the UK's south coast than Aucklands winters. Looking on line over the years, I get the impression that the UK summer skies are less convective than here overall. Thunderstorms don't necessarily indicate more cumulonimbus. My climate gets plenty of towering cumulus , but thunder is only a small percentage of such days. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2017 19:33:55 GMT -5
Well, one cannot make that comparison unless they have experienced both summers in both locations. Precipitation in southern UK is predominately convective in summer, especially in south eastern locations. Likewise, only a minority of those days will produce thunder/lightning (to the tune of about 1 thunder day per week on average), and because of the wide skyscapes in south coast locations and general lack of summer overcast, these places have very impressive views of convective clouds for great distances. I have collections of photos of the sky from times I have stayed on the SE coast in the last 4-5 summers but most are on my old computer. A typical example of the sky there in summer is the picture below. Most of the sky blue with convective clouds and anvils making up the rest of it. Even days that become overcast will have blue skies at least until the early afternoon. This picture was from July 2017 on a typical day, but later in the day, so these particular clouds had built up into an anvil cloud but there were numerous convective build ups around the sky.  |
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Post by Lommaren on Dec 1, 2017 19:49:41 GMT -5
Is the Pacific side facing the endless sea significantly warmer than the side facing Australia during summer?
I assume the westerlies over the ocean get warmed up travelling over the UHI?...
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2017 20:00:29 GMT -5
Nice photo.
People who have experienced both, have told me here is more active -particularly with the convective buildup over the mountains land, which is a lot closer.
Large buildup over the sea is also common.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2017 20:01:22 GMT -5
Is the Pacific side facing the endless sea significantly warmer than the side facing Australia during summer? I assume the westerlies over the ocean get warmed up travelling over the UHI?... Nope -the west coast is warmer, all the time. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2017 20:03:28 GMT -5
Is the Pacific side facing the endless sea significantly warmer than the side facing Australia during summer? I assume the westerlies over the ocean get warmed up travelling over the UHI?... Nope -the west coast is warmer, all the time. I'm not sure if Auckland has much of a UHI, with so much water and bush ... and sea breezes. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2017 20:03:33 GMT -5
Nice photo. People who have experienced both, have told me here is more active -particularly with the convective buildup over the mountains land, which is a lot closer. Large buildup over the sea is also common. Wish i'd taken that photo earlier, the cloud there is in its decaying stage (no new solid updrafts) but I was on the train at the time. Oh boo hoo. Getting cloud build ups over mountains doesn't surprise me, that's probably the one element missing here when it comes to effects on cloud formations. One thing that's important to add - is it's impossible to generalise "UK summer skies" when discussing summer cloudscapes because of the massive variations in such over the country. My focus is on the south coast (due to its summer sunshine levels being comparing with Aucklands), which has a vastly different cloudscape and sunshine/cloud ratio than the midlands and north. Compared to Buxton and other north western areas, which have tons of low cloud and overcast in summer, the south coast resembles more like the coast of France with much more blue sky, convective clouds and high level cloud. South coast areas get nearly 80% more sun in summer than Buxton! It's clear to almost anyone from here that NZ gets a lot less summer overcast than anywhere more than 30 or so miles north of our south coast. But it's funny how doing a google image search for summer sky in Auckland vs. south coast UK shows almost identical looking conditions/clouds throughout the results. Mostly consisting of scattered cumulus clouds. |
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